Water spots

H

Hock87

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So I painted this car March of 2018, never got to drive in until this last weekend. Universal clear was the clear recommended for its stone chip resistance and chemical resistance.
Now it did receive a stone chip from a vehicle in the other lane which is somewhat disappointing but the main disappointment is the water spotting. This clear sat for well over its curing time and after its first time sitting in rain it water spotted. So I sanded it with 3000 and 5000 before buffing and polishing it, then after making sure my work was good i ceramic coated it and it looked fantastic.
However here I am after ceramic coating it and I thought it was the coating that water spotted. Got a better look at it tonight and it turns out that some of the water spots are the ones I had trouble removing, as well as some etching from bugs that just laid on the car and died during the day, which I then rinsed off when I got home from work.
any suggestions on how to attack this? I don’t want to clear the car again.
 
I'm at a loss as a ceramic coating or wax cant water spot, so leaves the idea that the water spots were not removed in the original buffing, hear again none of this makes any sense, so I'm just guessing.
 
Barry, I think he was saying that the Universal water spotted and chipped. Then, he sanded and buffed then he ceramic coated and saw some missed water spots.

My question is how many coats of clear (universal is flexible beyond the number of coats that any sensible person would use) and, did this car ever see extended Sun light?
Universal is chip resistant not chip proof.
As for the spots, do you live in an industrialized area?
 
Add to what AAE said,

No clear is water spot resistant. Water spots came from allowing water (probably hard water) to dry on the surface. Simple. If hard water dries on the surface it is going to spot. It's not the clears fault.

No clear is chip proof. To expect a clear coat to be completely chip proof is silly. But chips come from what's underneath the clear not the clear itself. I'll give you the short version as I don't feel like writing for the next 10 minutes explaining it. Chips come from the inability of the substrate (what's below the clear) to adhere to the panel. 2k Urethane primers when used excessively are notorious for chipping. Too much material on an edge will chip, etc etc. How the car is prepped for paint is the most important factor in how resistant it will be to chips. Strip it to metal, use only SPI epoxy primer, no excessive amount of buildup on any part of the panel, no excessive use of body filler anywhere, you will have a chip resistant job. If you didn't strip the paint, used too much 2k Urethane primer in places. Used too much body filler or used improper techniques in applying any of those then your car will be more prone to chip.
 
If you ceramic coated over water spots you have a bit of a mess on your hands imho. The coating will need to be removed to address the water spots. Hopefully you used one that can be easily removed.

I use vinegar to remove water spots.

Don
 
Once I left a hood cleared with universal outside 3-4 hours after painting, and an afternoon thunderstorm popped up while I was in the booth. Water sat on it probably 2 hours and the sun came out shortly after the rain. I brought the hood inside before I went home and dried it off with no water spotting at all. I have seen water from a lawn sprinkler spot my wife's Suburban so bad it etched the glass, so I would guess water that hard would spot anything, including universal. Must have some acid rain where you live, or possibly the universal was mixed incorrectly. These are the only 2 things I can think of that would cause this.
 
all good info above. water spots are from the minerals that are in the water that is allowed to dry on the surface. it has nothing to do with the clear itself as chris said. now that you put ceramic im not sure what you can do really. thats the drawback with ceramic. as for the chipping, that is directly due to layer adhesion usually at the base to primer layers.
 
The water spots were treated, the car was re sanded with 3000 and 5000 to and then was buffed. There were zero water spots before the application of the ceramic coating. The spots bled back through. Upon further investigation with a professional detailer it is stated that after water spots are removed it needs to be subjected to some heat to check if the water spots will bleed back through. I’m assuming that’s what happened.
How much sun the car saw should be irrelevant at this point, it was painted in March of 2018. I live in a more rural area, so who knows however I didn’t expect one rain fall after it being painted for about a year and a half to water spot that bad. The last car I painted for myself was with dc4000 which isn’t a great clear at all and I never had an issue with water spots like this. The chip itself looks like it is just in the clear, so maybe it will sand out when I redo the water spots and ceramic in the spring.
 
@Hock87 So you never washed it for a year and a half, before that rain fell on it? You never got it wet? How did you sand it when you buffed it? If you did wash it why didn't it water spot then? Only after a rain a year and a half after you painted it did it spot? That seems strange.
 
what's ceramic stuff anyway. i like quality carnauba & hl white hand pad once a year or 2. blinds u like mirror.
 
my well water leave water spots from hell . takes some serious work to get a windshield clean . spots have 0 to do with clear choice it has to do with clearing over water spots in the beginning .
 
Yeah I washed the car several times, dried it off with a chamois every time. Can’t dry a car off when it rains over night while you’re passed out, all clear was mixed 1:1 with universal. The car sat in a heated shop for over a year after being painted that is a constant 70 in winter, and however damn hot it gets outside in the summer.
It sanded alright, used a piece of 3000 per panel, buffed okay with a DA polisher. Looked fine when I applied the ceramic, car sat outside for a few days since I do not have a garage currently and the same exact spots bled through. Now I’m hoping I don’t need to respray it because I just acquired a new job and no longer have a booth at my disposal. Not only that but to pull the window seals you need to remove the glass. So any suggestions? I never baked the clear. Only sprayed 4 coats. Had some die back on the hatch and sunroof but that seems to have disappeared.
 
The bottom line is the clear was miss-mixed at 4:1 or 4:2 or activator was opened and closed and weak. ( no other options)
Now with the ceramic coating applied to a non cured clear, it should lose adhesion down the road due to solvent traps and make it easier to strip.

This whole thing does not make chemical sense as if it does have ceramic on it how does the water go through the ceramic; it can't.
 
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I thought of something last night if everything was mixed perfect and that Ceramic coat was applied too soon. It would trap solvents as ceramic does not breathe.
If done too soon and it was, this could be the whole issue if everything else was done right.

Its been a while and my concern at this point is you have about a 70%
Chance the solvent has broken adhesion or will.
 
I’ve read through this a couple of times and nowhere can I see how long it was between when the clear was applied and the application of the ceramic coating. An important datapoint I think.

Don
 
Ceramic coating is popular among newer car forums on new thin ass paint, but still can't name a painter that uses it.
Talked to a new local chemical brothers distributor/ detail shop last year detailing a new black z-06 with it, he said he didn't care to try it on repaints.
 
Ceramic coating is popular among newer car forums on new thin ass paint, but still can't name a painter that uses it.
Talked to a new local chemical brothers distributor/ detail shop last year detailing a new black z-06 with it, he said he didn't care to try it on repaints.

Its a big profit item, so that and long term results do not go together or is a concern to the seller.
 
I have extremely hard water where I live. Even washing our Toyota Avalon and drying it with microfiber towels I still get water spots. Very aggravating for sure. I have to use 0000 steel wool to get windows truly clean and spot free.

When working with restorations I have to use distilled water in my final wipe downs.

Recently I purchased some Turtle Car Wash Soap from our local Ace Hardware. It claims to have water softening agents in it. I was amazed at how much better my Avalon looked after using it. Still rinsed with the hard water from my hose but when I wiped it dry with the microfiber towels the surface looked much better.
 
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