1963 Dodge Dart for the Wife....

Well she is wet sanded down the trunk is not done... spraying epoxy on it in the morning and getting some polyester spray on in a 2 days (48 hour wait after the epoxy per Barry).. The problems I had with the clear orange peel and striping where for a reason, if it all went down nice I would not want to redo the trunk.... I will get there eventually... Live and learn.
What happened to the trunk that it needs extra primer work?
 
What happened to the trunk that it needs extra primer work?
The crown is not right. With the color and clear it was obvious (even Cheryl said something does not look right). It is flat in one spot between the skeleton in the middle. Need a bit more filler to get the original shape in that area.
 
The crown is not right. With the color and clear it was obvious (even Cheryl said something does not look right). It is flat in one spot between the skeleton in the middle. Need a bit more filler to get the original shape in that area.
Mama ain't happy, nobody's happy.
 
When i painted my car i got stripes on the hood and trunk like you have. I repainted them 3 times. I did them on stands individually and could not figure out why i was getting stripes only when the clear was applied. The basecoat looked great until the clear went on. I tried a different clear and it didnt stripe. I never understood because the rest of the car came out fine. I talked to a guy and he told me when he does metallics he sprays a tack coat clear first. He says if you hammer the clear on the first coat you could disturb the metallics and cause stripes mottle and other weird thing. I took his advice when i sprayed a silver along with advice from members on this forum and was able to spray the silver withouf stripes
 
When i painted my car i got stripes on the hood and trunk like you have. I repainted them 3 times. I did them on stands individually and could not figure out why i was getting stripes only when the clear was applied. The basecoat looked great until the clear went on. I tried a different clear and it didnt stripe. I never understood because the rest of the car came out fine. I talked to a guy and he told me when he does metallics he sprays a tack coat clear first. He says if you hammer the clear on the first coat you could disturb the metallics and cause stripes mottle and other weird thing. I took his advice when i sprayed a silver along with advice from members on this forum and was able to spray the silver withouf stripes
On horizontal panels it's easy to get heavy handed with the clear because you aren't fighting gravity.
 
I got stripes on the trunk lid of the 65 Buick which was a maroon metallic. It was from tipping the gun slightly from perpendicular and thus applying too heavy on the side closest to the surface. As stated above it was from reaching too far and in my case getting a bit careless.

Never needed to do a tack coat to spray metallics but did find that better quality paint made a big difference in the results. Also, some metallic paints recommend a "drop coat" may be necessary. This is basically just over reducing the base and holding the gun farther from the surface and applying a mist coat to help distribute metallics evenly.

Truthfully, once my gun adjustments and technique were refined, I have never had to do anything but simply apply the base coat.
Sprayed a 1985 Dodge Pickup in Gunmetal Gray metallic no stripes.
The 55 Chevy was a tri-stage metallic pearl so made me a bit nervous but stuck with the plan and it turned out great as well.
 
IMO tack coat and mist coats are not relevant to modern basecoat systems. Pay attention to what TexasKing said in his post (#278). Misting the base on isn't the answer nor is holding the gun farther away, they will just cause new issues like excess texture in the basecoat which will show when cleared. Your issue is what Texas stated along with overlap and coverage. Keep the gun head horizontal to the surface. Keep the gun perpendicular (right angle) to the surface. Don't tilt the gun. Dial back your fluid a bit when you do the trunk again. Tighten up your overlap to closer to 75%. Don't tilt the gun. Spray medium coats, don't try to spray too heavy. Some metallics take four, even five coats (medium) to get coverage. If you are still having issues you can get "blender" at any jobber or through SPI (Intercoat clear). On your last one or two coats reduce your RTS base 1:1 with blender. That along with more overlap and keeping the gun oriented correctly will solve it.

It's looking really good Jim, doing a great job.:)
 
IMO tack coat and mist coats are not relevant to modern basecoat systems. Pay attention to what TexasKing said in his post (#278). Misting the base on isn't the answer nor is holding the gun farther away, they will just cause new issues like excess texture in the basecoat which will show when cleared. Your issue is what Texas stated along with overlap and coverage. Keep the gun head horizontal to the surface. Keep the gun perpendicular (right angle) to the surface. Don't tilt the gun. Dial back your fluid a bit when you do the trunk again. Tighten up your overlap to closer to 75%. Don't tilt the gun. Spray medium coats, don't try to spray too heavy. Some metallics take four, even five coats (medium) to get coverage. If you are still having issues you can get "blender" at any jobber or through SPI (Intercoat clear). On your last one or two coats reduce your RTS base 1:1 with blender. That along with more overlap and keeping the gun oriented correctly will solve it.

It's looking really good Jim, doing a great job.:)

Jeez, this is good stuff! My first full paint, to come, will be a metallic and the tiger striping is something I really fear. A few years ago, a buddy had his car painted, was proud of it, and wanted to show it to me. It was a metallic and badly tiger striped. He was very pleased with it and not to hurt his feelings, I made like it was great! I never could understand how he did not see that and I'm a eye-doc..... lol!

Jim, please let us know what you did to alleviated the stripes? That's going to be beautiful when you're done! Your an inspiration!!!
 
IMO tack coat and mist coats are not relevant to modern basecoat systems. Pay attention to what TexasKing said in his post (#278). Misting the base on isn't the answer nor is holding the gun farther away, they will just cause new issues like excess texture in the basecoat which will show when cleared. Your issue is what Texas stated along with overlap and coverage. Keep the gun head horizontal to the surface. Keep the gun perpendicular (right angle) to the surface. Don't tilt the gun. Dial back your fluid a bit when you do the trunk again. Tighten up your overlap to closer to 75%. Don't tilt the gun. Spray medium coats, don't try to spray too heavy. Some metallics take four, even five coats (medium) to get coverage. If you are still having issues you can get "blender" at any jobber or through SPI (Intercoat clear). On your last one or two coats reduce your RTS base 1:1 with blender. That along with more overlap and keeping the gun oriented correctly will solve it.

It's looking really good Jim, doing a great job.:)
Understood. But why would a basecoat look fine without stripes. Until clear is sprayed?
 
Understood. But why would a basecoat look fine without stripes. Until clear is sprayed?
Short answer is your eyes don't know what to look for. One of those things that if you aren't doing it a lot you may not see it. I can promise you this though, if it's there it's there. If it isn't it's not. Poor lighting would be the biggest contributor to this. Base may look fine in substandard lighting but once the clear is on it you can see it. Lighting is one of those things that you may think you have enough if you are spraying in a home booth but usually you don't have enough of. There is a reason why quality commercial paint booths have so much light . Booth at the collision shop I recently left had 16 4 tube florescents in a 26x14.5 booth, and at times there would still be a shadow and not enough light when trying to do something.

One thing to try is when you have finished spraying base, take a bright light, and sweep over the panels. If there is striping you will see it with the light. Good thing is that modern basecoats are much easier to spray than in the past. As long as you use good technique and proper temp reducer (slower is better) One of the reasons I use slow all year round is the fact that it allows the metallic to orient itself correctly. Spraying base in 70+ degree temps with medium reducer and marginal technique will result in issues more often than not.

If you are having issues one other thing to remember is the closer you get to true coverage the less issues you will have with striping.

Best thing you can do is if there is any doubt, get some blender, mix it 1:1 with RTS base and spray one more coat.
 
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I have seen metallics mottle, but not stripe, from clearing over the base too soon. It is usually good practice to give metallics extra flash time, so the metallic is stable and doesn't move when spraying a wet coat of clear over it.
 
Short answer is your eyes don't know what to look for. One of those things that if you aren't doing it a lot you may not see it. I can promise you this though, if it's there it's there. If it isn't it's not. Poor lighting would be the biggest contributor to this. Base may look fine in substandard lighting but once the clear is on it you can see it. Lighting is one of those things that you may think you have enough if you are spraying in a home booth but usually you don't have enough of. There is a reason why quality commercial paint booths have so much light . Booth at the collision shop I recently left had 16 4 tube florescents in a 26x14.5 booth, and at times there would still be a shadow and not enough light when trying to do something.

One thing to try is when you have finished spraying base, take a bright light, and sweep over the panels. If there is striping you will see it with the light. Good thing is that modern basecoats are much easier to spray than in the past. As long as you use good technique and proper temp reducer (slower is better) One of the reasons I use slow all year round is the fact that it allows the metallic to orient itself correctly. Spraying base in 70+ degree temps with medium reducer and marginal technique will result in issues more often than not.

If you are having issues one other thing to remember is the closer you get to true coverage the less issues you will have with striping.

Best thing you can do is if there is any doubt, get some blender, mix it 1:1 with RTS base and spray one more coat.
Good info. Thanks
 
I have seen metallics mottle, but not stripe, from clearing over the base too soon. It is usually good practice to give metallics extra flash time, so the metallic is stable and doesn't move when spraying a wet coat of clear over it.
Thanks. If you had to put a number on it, how important is the quality of the gun? 50%?
 
I am over my depression from the failed attempt so let me give more details. I knew it was striped before I shot the clear. The plan was to get a coat of clear on just to finish the day. I had also saw the big bowl in the trunk that needed to be fixed since the rest of the car is so straight so I knew I was going to have to redo it so why not just shoot the clear as I had it mixed and see how bad it was. There is no question I was not being diligent about 90 degrees to the trunk. Was I doing better on the hood or did I get more lucky? I don't know the answer. I was using about a 75% overlap and you can see at least I was fairly consistent on my over lap, one good outcome of this :). I applied Icing glaze over the problem areas and super carefully blocked it out and shot a couple coats of epoxy but there is still a small spot that needs attention but I am out of icing again, road trip for the daughters tomorrow. I was totally burned out fighting with that trunk before and knew it was not right before I started but I was convincing myself it would not be noticeable... So at the end of the day the stripes on the trunk only was karma telling me I was not done with the trunk and to fix it right.
 
The quality of the gun definitely matters, but a clean cheap gun will still spray better than a dirty good gun. Pattern is most important, and if the pattern is good, I would say gun 25%, technique 75%.
Quality of basecoat plays a factor too. Reality is there a bunch of factors lol. Thats why i laugh when i see cars on craigslist. "Primer ready for paint" "just needs a good coat of paint on it"...
 
Thanks. If you had to put a number on it, how important is the quality of the gun? 50%?
I liked playing tennis as a Teen. I was pretty good at it and did pretty well at a regional level. I remember what an Instructor told me once when I was complaining about not having as nice a racquet as some of the guys I was playing against. He told me that an elite world class player in the top 20 could beat anyone outside of the top 200 in the world with a wooden racquet even though his competition would be playing with state of the art equipment.
Meaning the best racquet out there isn't going to make you the best player.
It's all about technique, learning it and mastering it. Everything else is secondary.
 
I liked playing tennis as a Teen. I was pretty good at it and did pretty well at a regional level. I remember what an Instructor told me once when I was complaining about not having as nice a racquet as some of the guys I was playing against. He told me that an elite world class player in the top 20 could beat anyone outside of the top 200 in the world with a wooden racquet even though his competition would be playing with state of the art equipment.
Meaning the best racquet out there isn't going to make you the best player.
It's all about technique, learning it and mastering it. Everything else is secondary.
I used to tell my son similar when he was younger playing baseball. All cool kids had a 400 dollar bat...
 
Ok rewind.... like I said the trunk was bad so I spent evening this week blocking more glaze but it is nice now.... also picked up the first batch of chrome parts and polishing... very nice work.... I'll keep that a secret till it is going back together.... spent today sanding out orange peel and getting back to where I was last weekend..... light wind tomorrow so up early and light wet sand these two coats and two or three good heavy ones then see where we are....

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