Two Tone with Silver question.

[MikeK]

Doing 2 body's of a Datsun 240Z BRE'ish scheme. Owner wanting opposing colors of Silver and Black.
#99 is Black top,Silver bottom.
#66 is Silver top,Black bottom.
Used the Exact same Base's. SPI Black,Chromabase Big metallic Silver, which I use under my kandys.
Question is,
Why does the Silver on 99 look Darker?
Because the Black is above it?
66 looks as "expected" and great Silver color.
I even reshot the 99 which on application is what I want but after drying is back Darker.
Same Everything on both body's. I mean Everything from bare body to base.
Optical illusion? Clear coat brightened it some but obviously darker.
Got me puzzled.

 

[Jim C]

possibly because being sprayed on a horizontal surface the flakes laid down flatter making them look brighter. in the pic of 99 it even looks more grainy or coarse. its not because there is black under it assuming you got good coverage.

 

[Chris_Hamilton]

Did you shoot the silver over the black on the 99? If so that's why it's darker. You would need to spray more coats to get to true coverage.

 

[Jim C]

not to confuse because chris and i gave different answers.....

silvers are not a transparent pigment. its aluminum powder so you cant see through it like a red or yellow where base color will change the topcoat color. once silver is covered then its covered. key word here is covered. if you put enough silver on to get solid coverage then base color wont make a difference.

 

[Chris_Hamilton]

Three coats of a silver base over white is going to look very different than three coats over a black base. Most silvers formulas have some opaqueness to them as they are not all just one pigment.

 

[MikeK]

I use a real fine,mica Silver Under my top coat big Silver generally anyway for coverage for this reason. It's a really great pre base for spotting less than obvious imperfections too.
Probably because I did a really Wet coat the second time too. But he wanted it "sparkly".
It looks like Black overspray but the Black was already on the top and bottom was masked with the mica on already. Then I did the respray over the first big Silver Which reguardless, should look right.
I still think it has to do with the Black above and resulting reflection..
Outside with Clear is better obviously but different.

 

[MikeK]

Years ago I asked my paint jobber, who is a painter,
What is the Best primer color for Silver?
Black.
Not what I expected but after doing some, believe he was correct.
I've sprayed a Lot of Silvers and Never had one do this.
Why I'm asking.
Also,when doing "chrome" paints,you apply over Black base.

 

[Barry]

Years ago I asked my paint jobber, who is a painter,
What is the Best primer color for Silver?
Black.
Not what I expected but after doing some, believe he was correct.
I've sprayed a Lot of Silvers and Never had one do this.
Why I'm asking.
Also,when doing "chrome" paints,you apply over Black base.

Guess I've been wrong but I have always said over gray.
Live and learn.

 

[Chris_Hamilton]

Years ago I asked my paint jobber, who is a painter,
What is the Best primer color for Silver?
Black.
Not what I expected but after doing some, believe he was correct.
I've sprayed a Lot of Silvers and Never had one do this.
Why I'm asking.
Also,when doing "chrome" paints,you apply over Black base.

The only reason would be for ease of application for the painter. Especially if you are using something like Jim mentioned above with a high aluminum pigment content or the chrome stuff the undercoat color doesn't matter cause it's essentially solid. Black would be the most contrasting color and easiest to use to ensure that there is full coverage which would be critical with a chrome paint especially.

I would tell that Jobber to try doing a blend repair on a vehicle with an OEM silver color using black primer to repair. Say I have a dent in a 1/4 panel to repair then blend to the door and rest of the 1/4. If I used black primer to cover the repair and then try to blend over it, it would be a disaster. If I could get it to blend I would use 2X or more the amount of base that I would use if matching the undercoat to the basecoat.

And don't forget that any chips which take out the base but leave the undercoat would be magnified with a contrasting color like black as the undercoat.

Grey is still the best choice and also the most economical which with the cost of base these days, matters.

Disclaimer: Everything I wrote is in reference to refinishing vehicles. Model cars I have no experience with.

 

[OJ86]

And I thought painting model cars would be less stressful!

 

[MikeK]

Custom is a different World than Scratch & Dent.
The Bases are so lacking you need All the help you can afford. Unless your using SPI.
And yes,Gray is the "preferred" color.
I asked which is Best, not what is prefered or recommended.
Their not Model cars.
Their Slot Cars and considering I've made close to 5 grand so far this year in my air conditioned shop sitting at my bench,
I'm pretty happy with the little guys.
Outside today curing clear.
Sparkly as Requested!! Customer Loves it which is all I'm concerned about.
Guess it's the flop and lighting.

 

[Chris_Hamilton]

I asked which is Best, not what is prefered or recommended.

"Best" is subjective and subject to what is being done. Most don't do model cars so I tried to give some perspective for others reading this who might think what you wrote applies to them. It doesn't. And black is only recommended there so you have a contrasting palette to work off of. Not ideal for everything but a few specific circumstances. Models being one. Irregardless using black as an undercoat does nothing for the actual look of the silver when you achieve coverage. It's just a contrasting color.
No one wants to lay down 6-12 coats of base over black on a vehicle. Needless expense and wasted effort.

 

[MikeK]

Wow.

 

[OJ86]

didn't mean any disrespect with my model cars comment.

 

[MikeK]

None taken.
It just seems simple questions and answers go into a completely different realm at times depending on point of view around here.
Make no mistake. The Individuals in this slot car hobby are as Intense as in full size cars.
I had no idea it even still existed but is very much "a big deal" and covid had a major impact resurrecting it. When you see a 3" plastic car sell for almost 4,000.00, it's Serious.
I quit painting real cars years ago because it's Hard,Expensive,Meticulous Work and Vinyl was talking over and I was Tired and an alcoholic and had to rebuild Me.
So I still paint most every day using the same products and procedures,have Fun doing it,make some "fishing money" and Enjoy Life. Sober
Try doing one yourself, I double dog dare ya.....

 

[1A Rock]

None taken.
It just seems simple questions and answers go into a completely different realm at times depending on point of view around here.
Make no mistake. The Individuals in this slot car hobby are as Intense as in full size cars.
I had no idea it even still existed but is very much "a big deal" and covid had a major impact resurrecting it. When you see a 3" plastic car sell for almost 4,000.00, it's Serious.
I quit painting real cars years ago because it's Hard,Expensive,Meticulous Work and Vinyl was talking over and I was Tired and an alcoholic and had to rebuild Me.
So I still paint most every day using the same products and procedures,have Fun doing it,make some "fishing money" and Enjoy Life. Sober
Try doing one yourself, I double dog dare ya.....

Some friends and I had a kind of club racing slot cars a few years ago. It gets pretty interesting watching grown men play with little cars and take it so seriously. The friend who had the track in his basement, had a house fire, lost everything. Do you paint these on the inside or outside? The shells we were using were clear, we painted them on the inside.

 

[MikeK]

Just o'spray.
Lexan pin on body's. Light for hard-core racing and unsprung weight control.
There are a lot of people already doing those and I'm NO artist which some of those are works of art.
I was bored one day and had a Tyco version of a Hot Wheels Twin Mill body laying on the bench and remembered mine from back in the late 60's,which I still have, and the metallic Cinnamon Red.
Why not,I still have all the paint products and did a few. Kept seeing these so called "customs" for sale that looked like my 5yr old g'son painted with Testors sell for 30-50 dollars.
Ok,let's just see what happens. Sold all I had the first week.
People Like Cool Cars Period and Size is relative to the Person's Interests.
And a lot of my clients Have Real Cars from tri5's,Vetts,Mustangs,Ferrari, Porsche, you name it and I provide miniature versions of Their Cars for Their race tracks. And they are Ecstatic about it.

This Site is about Paint Products manufactured by SPI and proper use of Them.
Which could be, about ANYTHING.
I paint "anything" because people who have Cars want "car things" to accentuate Them.
Toolboxes,furniture, refrigerator, picture frames, lawn mowers,kitchen appliances,guitars,etc.
I LOVE TO PAINT !! And it doesn't have to be a Car.... But .

 

[elwood]

I'm sure there are people on here who have redone an old pedal car. Done right they are so neat.

 

[RosharonRooster]

I'm sure there are people on here who have redone an old pedal car. Done right they are so neat.

I have a 59 impala pedal car stored away when I get time. Lol

 

[OJ86]

I painted these once for a buddy who drag races electric cars. I'd do these all day long over real cars.