time is a problem

shine;8173 said:
after 7 days you have to sand it to put anything on it. period.
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ah ok well i can do that so. after 7 days i'de have to sand before i can put on the filler. then after the filler i can shoot another coat of epoxy. sounds good thank you
 
Barry.... It is easy to understand if you look at why we use the epoxy. It is applied to the bare metal to seal out moisture and such. It seals stuff out once it has mostly cured, or about 7 days. Once it cures, the adhesion of anything added to the surface will be limited, thanks to the great sealing properties. Ideally, once it has reached 7 days, you should sand the epoxy and apply another coat of epoxy to that surface. That would give you fresh epoxy to bond to. Nothing will stick to cured epoxy as good as epoxy itself.

Aaron
 
ADTKART;8420 said:
Barry.... It is easy to understand if you look at why we use the epoxy. It is applied to the bare metal to seal out moisture and such. It seals stuff out once it has mostly cured, or about 7 days. Once it cures, the adhesion of anything added to the surface will be limited, thanks to the great sealing properties. Ideally, once it has reached 7 days, you should sand the epoxy and apply another coat of epoxy to that surface. That would give you fresh epoxy to bond to. Nothing will stick to cured epoxy as good as epoxy itself.

Aaron
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so then if i put one coat down then say the next day fix all the little dimple or dings then i could put my second coat of epoxy on as long as im in the window.then i would have a couple of days to relax then put the bc/cc on.

barry
 
That works for me. I usually try to do everything within a few days of shooting the epoxy. Otherwise just scuff it and shoot another coat of epoxy and good to go.

Aaron
 
ADTKART;8452 said:
That works for me. I usually try to do everything within a few days of shooting the epoxy. Otherwise just scuff it and shoot another coat of epoxy and good to go.

Aaron
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thank you and im going to follow it to the letter

barry
 
no more of that. i went saturday to old sherwood williams (closest place) and bought some of the demension dp800 epoxy primer and i this morning at 89degrees i put a coat on the car and it looks good. i guess. i used a slower reducer because of the temp but it looks pretty thick and flat and nice. so tomarrow im going to do the body work(small stuff) and the next day ill throw another coat of epoxy on it and go from there.

thanks shine
 
TheOtherBarry;8464 said:
no more of that. i went saturday to old sherwood williams (closest place) and bought some of the demension dp800 epoxy primer and i this morning at 89degrees i put a coat on the car and it looks good. i guess. i used a slower reducer because of the temp but it looks pretty thick and flat and nice. so tomarrow im going to do the body work(small stuff) and the next day ill throw another coat of epoxy on it and go from there.

thanks shine
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Shrink and Wrinkle is its real name!!!

glad you got Epoxy on it even if it is ....

Best of luck.Travis.
 
man you need to stay away from that stuff. sw dimension is the absolute worst crap i ever shot. i had to repaint a 55 because of that junk . as a matter of fact i wont even paint my house with sw .
 
DP800 works decently, in my opinion. SPI is better, but I had no beef with the DP800. It dried to a sandable finish, and adhered well to metal. Filler would adhere to it without sanding within the window, just like any decent epoxy primer.

I won't comment on products with which I have no direct experience.

Also, I would like to state for the record that Sherwin-Williams primers and clears are among the best I have ever used, and Dimension primers and clears are fairly decent.
 
I don't understand why someone would ask the questions to get all the needed answers for using SPI epoxy and then go with something that is not as good.

Aaron
 
Hotbo;8465 said:
Shrink and Wrinkle is its real name!!!

glad you got Epoxy on it even if it is ....

Best of luck.Travis.
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when does this stuff wrinkle up? i asked the salesman about any flaus and he said that if i dont use heat to dry it it might stay loose for a while (may take 2 days to cure.
other than that it looks like it laid down real nice

barry
 
I work in a collision shop during the day. The last 3 shops I have worked in used SW products, as they are a big player in this area. I have never tried their epoxy primer, but have read several complaints about it not being as durable as a real epoxy. People have reported that it can be attacked by reducers and lacquer thinner even after "curing". Something that is not an issue with SPI.

I am not surprised that the salesman didn't tell you about any problems with the product. He is, afterall, a salesman, not a painter. Most of them have never shot a car before. They are trained to always blame the painter for any problems, so there are no problems with the product.
 
ADTKART;8515 said:
I work in a collision shop during the day. The last 3 shops I have worked in used SW products, as they are a big player in this area. I have never tried their epoxy primer, but have read several complaints about it not being as durable as a real epoxy. People have reported that it can be attacked by reducers and lacquer thinner even after "curing". Something that is not an issue with SPI.

I am not surprised that the salesman didn't tell you about any problems with the product. He is, afterall, a salesman, not a painter. Most of them have never shot a car before. They are trained to always blame the painter for any problems, so there are no problems with the product.
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it would be nice if i could find a spi dealer in my area. here in st.cloud fl. i have to go 2 towns over just to get a sherwood dealer. maybe there is a spi dealer but i havent found him.
 
i live in ranch country. it is 25 miles to town and they dont have anything but junk . one place carries ppg but it is over priced . i order all my paint .
 
A quick call to SPI and you can find out if there is a local jobber. If there isn't one, you can order the correct stuff and have it delivered at your door, probably within a couple of days.

Before we had a local jobber, i could get anything here in VA within 3 days MAX. The people that you deal with know how to use the products, not just the prices or item numbers.

Now.... If you have a problem with the SW products in the evening or on weekends what number are you going to call? For the prices of their products, they should send someone to help you do the job.

Aaron
 
Look, I have used SPI epoxy extensively, and also went through a gallon of DP800 a year or so ago, doing some testing along the way:

There is nothing particularly wrong with DP800. It needs no induction, it is solvent resistant in a timely fashion, filler sticks well without sanding within the window, and its adhesion to bare metal is good. It doesn't have as much dry film build as SPI, is harder to sand, and is more expensive.

So all considered, SPI for the win. but by no means is DP800 a junk product.
 
TheOtherBarry;8472 said:
when does this stuff wrinkle up? i asked the salesman about any flaus and he said that if i dont use heat to dry it it might stay loose for a while (may take 2 days to cure.
other than that it looks like it laid down real nice

barry
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we call it Shrink and Wrinkle b/c it is very touchy Paint line.

use to be a lot worse years ago and there products were always behind the other top lines.

times have changed and im sure they have came a long way?

i dont like anything about them and im with Shine i wont paint my house much less anything else im doing with SW.



but Crash seems to like it and i know of at least 1 other person that does,lol!!!!!!!!!!!!


the Jobber where i get my Pro-spray mixed also had a SW mixing bank for 12 years,he had Dupont before that(SW made him a better deal)he said it was a nightmare and he agreed with the Shrink and Wrinkle part!!!!!!!!!!!!!


all kidding aside i have never used it over 3-4 times in the past 15 years and my ole man never used it in his 45 years.

i sprayed some Dimenson the other day a customer had bought(jackass)to think he would save money by doing it this way.

i have better things to do than lay 5 coats of junk ass paint under my SPi clear so i threw the Shit away and mixed my Pro-spray.

so imo i will use better products.

Nothing but SPI and Pro-spray for my bases.
 
in the 40+ years i have been in this sw has always been considered bottom feeder paint. cheap paint for cheap jobs. i thought omni was the worst paint on the market until i tried dimension . use it and it will be the weak link in the job and most likely will fail .
 
There are many different types of Dimension topcoats, and many are of poor quality. I have not mentioned much about their topcoats here, but I will say there are only a handful of them which are suitable for use on anything decent. The trick is to know which ones, and it's doubtful the average paint store employee knows anything about it.

What they have tried to do with Dimension is create a product for every budget, so that there are about half a dozen core resin technologies in play, and their tints need a lot of whatever resin is to be used in order to work. In a way, it is a really smart and fascinating way to get many different qualities of paint out of one line of tints. In another way, it is a horrible idea, because their 1K alkyd enamel is called "Dimension," and their acrylic urethane and high solids basecoat are also called "Dimension," even though they perform nothing alike. I wouldn't paint a garbage can with their 1K enamel, but I have vehicles out there, cleared with their top-line urethane, that look just as good 5 years later as the day they were sprayed.

But right now, I am only speaking of ONE product here, an epoxy primer that I have actually used and tested alongside SPI epoxy for comparison.

DP800 epoxy primer will not cause a failure, but it's not as good as SPI epoxy primer.

Bash away.
 
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